Teen dating. Talking about relationships or 'help, my son's come home with a hickey!'

Rachel Richards 0:25

Hello and welcome to Teenagers Untangled, the audio hug for parents going through the teenage years. I'm Rachel Richards, parent and coach, mother of two teenagers and two bonus daughters.

Susie Asli 0:35

Hi there, I'm Susie Asli, mindfulness coach, mindfulness therapist and musician, and mother of three teenagers, two of them are twins.

Rachel Richards 0:43

Now Susie. I was messaged by Stacy, whose nearly 15 year old son came home with a hickey. I got a fight on his neck. Now this was the second time. The first, she and her partner or husband had asked him not to let it happen again. I asked my daughter what she thought and she looked at me blankly and went like, why is that a problem?

Susie Asli 1:06

Yeah, yeah, yeah, we've experienced that, have you?

Rachel Richards 1:09

Yeah, yeah yeah, well, I won't ask you what was interesting, what did you do?

Susie Asli 1:15

It was family dinner time. Suggested he went and put on a hoodie.

Rachel Richards 1:21

Is that so that you didn't have to look at it?

Susie Asli 1:23

No, it was so that his siblings wouldn't take the mick, and my parents were coming for dinner. Let's just cover it up, but he wasn't that fussed. It wasn't a big deal and we talked about it because it happened a couple of times. It wasn't a big deal. It's like, oh, it's just, you know, people do that which in my day was like ooh, ooh, that was a big deal. I don't think it is.

Rachel Richards 1:47

And I think that's what's interesting is because when we react to something, I guess we just need to check our own feelings about it, and why is it this? Is such a big thing for me, and how do they feel about? It and then try and work your way through that as to whether this really is a big deal, because I think quite often people feel like it's a reflection of their parenting, perhaps particularly when they're young. And when you're teenager becomes sexual, it can feel very confrontational.

Susie Asli 2:16

Yes, because a lot of us aren't ready. No, it is quite a statement, isn't it? It's very visual.

Rachel Richards 2:23

Yes, and I think there's an element of marking your territory when people do this. We'll talk about that in our discussion because actually it's a fascinating area. She's not the only one who I know who got upset about it. I was at a party where my mother said exactly the same thing about a boy who was exactly the same age and she felt it was very disrespectful. So we'll talk about that. Anyway, I thought it was a great way of discussing the whole dating scene for teens, because it can feel actually quite triggering for us parents.

Susie Asli 2:55

It's not how it was in our day.

Rachel Richards 2:57

It's not in my day. No, we just stood around in semi-detached houses drinking Southern Comfort lemonade and snogging, whoever went past. Of course, that's my past and you've had a son in a mysterious relationship, so that's really useful. And I've got two bonus daughters, so I've got some. Anyway let's talk about nuggets first shall we?

Susie Asli 3:17

Yeah, my nugget is unrelated to that and it's this week. One of my twins has timekeeping challenges.

Rachel Richards 3:25

No.

Susie Asli 3:29

And it very much comes to a front in the mornings and there's a train time. You either miss get the train or you miss it. Timekeeping is important and we have a big field they have to cross in the mornings and it's really wet at the moment. There's loads of dew and my daughter has a hole in her shoe, so that's a whole other story. So I've been very kindly, I think, driving them to the station, which is literally two minutes away.

Susie Asli 3:53

So my son has been getting later and later and one morning we raced to the station and I felt that that was dangerous for me and I was kind of went, this is not okay, I'm not doing that again. That's crazy. So we have like, if you're not down by 56 past the hour, then you miss the lift. You have to get the next train, okay, okay. And he was pushing the boundaries, pushing the boundaries, so it's 58. I'm like, come on, it's happening again. And I said if you're not there one morning, it's really calm, you're not going to make it, you still eating your breakfast, and it's like 55. Wow, I said I will drive, like I will go, and he didn't quite believe me. I don't think so I did.

Rachel Richards 4:30

Oh, absolutely. You can't threaten things and not follow through.

Susie Asli 4:33

Yeah, and my daughter was sitting there going come on, we have to go, and so we did, and he was a bit cross about that, but totally fine, so you can be cross if you like, but he got it as well. And the same morning I also made him pay for the gate key that he's lost.

Rachel Richards 4:45

Right.

Susie Asli 4:46

So I said well, let's just go all in. And can you also give me, is it really expensive, the stupid keys? And it costs 25 grids, which is really expensive, so he had that and the key and he was unbelievably gracious about it. He was annoyed. I said you can be annoyed and you'll be really gracious. That's really cool and his timekeeping has slightly improved.

Rachel Richards 5:06

It's an interesting one because when I was coaching parenting, this came up a lot and it's really important that when we put in place boundaries or we say this is what's going to happen, that you follow through, because when we don't, for the next four or five times, they won't believe you know and you have to sort of in. And the worst thing is don't put in place something that you're not prepared to go through with. So you know, no television for a week is a really bad thing when they're little, because you're the person who will probably suffer most.

Rachel Richards 5:36

Just straightforward, here's that, here's the boundary, and and it's staying, it's not moving great well, done you to pay for the key.

Rachel Richards 5:44

So for me, I had one of those weeks where I had a lot of conversations with my teenagers that involved big emotions for various reasons and it was fascinating because these, these waves, these things that they experience us, this sometimes straw men, but they can be very upsetting in their world and it's there all sorts of things that would trigger really big emotions in a teenager. And they call me, talk to me about these things and I wanted to talk about how it makes us feel as parents, because it's it can really be triggering again that word but it actually makes you feel like either you're transported back to being a teenager or that you want to rescue them, your parents, you're just, your child is suffering. I want to go and you can feel physically furious because you've gone into that fight, flight, freeze yourself and I'm helpless, or helpless, and it's you up all night thinking, oh, my goodness. But what's fascinating about it is and I've talked to my teens is that we kind of need to be a bucket for their emotions that they can pour them into and and then maybe just kind of look into the bucket together and just say so, you know, and unpick some of the stuff that's been going on, maybe suggest things, maybe not give them a chance to actually work it out themselves.

Rachel Richards 7:09

And what's really interesting is that we're left with this sense of trauma. You know what's we've? Our kids have dumped all this on us. I sort of made me understand what it must feel like to be a therapist at times where you listen to very, very difficult things. They get up, walk out feeling lighter and happier. The problem is, your team might run, you know, hung off and gone off, and the next day they're perfectly happy. And you're still mulling over the problem because you still feel like you need to fix it.

Susie Asli 7:38

And it's as a therapist, it's harder with your teenagers, I would say I exactly that's the thing, because as a therapist, you're not emotionally involved.

Rachel Richards 7:46

It's not your triggers, your own stuff to deal with that Exactly how to separate and it's harder.

Susie Asli 7:52

You can do that with your teenager, but it's harder. I love the idea of the bucket. It's really important that they feel that they can dump in the bucket.

Rachel Richards 7:58

Yes, just like literally, and they've said that to me. They said, you know, it just makes a big difference just to be able to just drop it all, and then they're relieved and they can go away feeling better. So, coming back to dating, there's a lot of categories for dating now, so first of all, should we have a quick review.

Susie Asli 8:15

Yeah, I have two lovely reviews here. One of them is called great down to earth advice. I love listening to your podcast. It is a great mixture of research, wisdom nuggets and examples from everyday life, great topics and always spot on advice. Sometimes it is even enough just to hear that I'm not the only one having a hard time with my teenagers. Yeah, that's kind of why we do it and that's how.

Rachel Richards 8:35

I feel that way too.

Susie Asli 8:36

Exactly. Special thanks for taking time researching and talking about twins and emotional intelligence. I found it fascinating. You're so welcome. Thank you for the lovely review.

Rachel Richards 8:44

Yeah, absolutely. And another really good suggestion Short one saved my sanity.

Susie Asli 8:49

Oh, that's quite a big thing. We went through a period of struggling with our 14-ager listening. Listening to teenagers untangled has provided me and my husband with priceless insight and many tools to cope. Oh, thank you very much. That's really lovely.

Rachel Richards 9:03

Yeah, wow, well, yeah helping people with their sanity has got to be good. Yeah, I'm not quite sure about my own. Yeah, that's quite impressive, right? So coming back to dating, there seem to be a lot of categories now. You know, when I was a teenager, you were kind of Going out with someone, or you weren't. Now I've heard the terms talking, walking. So talking is when you're chatting to somebody.

Rachel Richards 9:30

but you're not going out with them. And walking is kind of similar where you go out on, you go out with them, but you're not going out with them. You just kind of wondering around aimlessly, right? I don't know these terms.

Rachel Richards 9:40

I've heard a lot of these terms linking, which is apparently friends with benefits Situation ship. No one has a clue what's going on. You're together but you're not exclusive. Necessarily until you actually go exclusive. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I am. This actually extends into the sort of twenty year olds I've seen that where they date but until they've actually both agreed that they are exclusive, they're not. Wow, that's my boyfriend, but you're not actually assuming that they are exclusive see presume you're not exclusive until you actually say the opposite.

Rachel Richards 10:16

It's not interesting, yeah, and what's really interesting with the twenty year olds, because of course, I got bonus daughters and. I have access to all these little bit higher generation. I've seen some married with a house mortgage dog, yes and some who their attitude is I'm enjoying my freedom. You got to try it with your guy friends, see if there's something there, and then you settle into friendships and so it's a much more relaxed attitude for some of them.

Susie Asli 10:47

Yeah, right not all of them we got.

Rachel Richards 10:49

We've got quite a range. That which is fascinating, right. So I, on terms of teens, I dig around for dating stats. There was a research report by Jean tweng of San Diego State University Journal in the journal child development, who said that they found the percentage of 12th graders who had ever gone on a date in 1990 to 1994 was 84%. Between 2010 and 2016 they said it was 63%. Now, what's your definition of data?

Rachel Richards 11:21

but this kind of mimics, what we found in teen delinquency remember that episode where we actually found that all these these marks of teenage delinquency, including teenage pregnancies, have dropped, so that actually would indicate the same thing.

Susie Asli 11:36

Yeah, really interesting. And I just wonder, because I think my experience is that they face time or maybe it's not. Yes, not face time is using their video calling yes, and that has quite a big effect, I think, doesn't it? Because you're actually having a proper conversation rather than Then. So if you don't need to go on so many days, I don't know, I don't know, or need a condom, really.

Rachel Richards 12:00

Anyway, we do. We take teen relationships seriously. Well, for teens it's really really important that. The truth is, they are, in relative terms, are quite short, and we often look at it and go, oh, sweet, sweet, but for them it's a really big thing, isn't it? Having said that, you know, the relationship between teenagers in high school at is only vaguely similar to that about couples, because they're kind of dating in greenhouse conditions, aren't they? They? They don't have to earn money or rent a house or pay taxes and what you know. It's a much less. It's less fraught in that way. It's more about issues like you know, how do I communicate with somebody? Purely emotional, purely emotional. It's very kind of interesting just make that distinction. So why do they date?

Susie Asli 12:51

well, fun fun, fun.

Rachel Richards 12:53

They've got hormones.

Rachel Richards 12:54

They first each other and and the hormones are really, really critical. So a lot of hormones are triggered with this and you know it's a way of trying out their sexuality, their bodies, all these Wonderful things about it biological. Isn't it retracted to people? And I think if we look at relationships as From a, from a love perspective and a marriage perspective, it's quite limiting. One of the things I hit on when I was talking to my daughters about this was one of the key things is status, and what I mean by that is soon as you start dating Of any type and no people notice it, they're talking, yeah, talking about it, and and it can elevate you. So if you've got a boyfriend or you've got a girlfriend, it sort of gives you status, cuz wow you.

Susie Asli 13:42

Someone else, someone else. Yes, so it's crazy, but it's true it's true.

Rachel Richards 13:46

it's how we work as human beings, and if I noticed this when I was young, if a boy starts to find you attractive, this works both ways. Other boys will go wait, wait, wait, what she got, what she got, and they suddenly everybody starts to notice that maybe your more interesting than they thought. So there's a huge data salad to it.

Susie Asli 14:09

Yeah, it's also on a more primal level as well isn't it. It is biology we get attracted to people. It's biology, it's really normal, it's a survival thing, isn't it? And it's very exciting when someone finds us attractive and we follow those emotions, we follow that adrenaline, we follow those hormones that then get released upon that, and it's really normal, it's really beautiful.

Rachel Richards 14:31

I wanted to mention love just because I think we often get confused about what we're talking about here because love is such a really I just think it's a really useless word.

Susie Asli 14:40

I think oh, rachel.

Rachel Richards 14:41

We're so limiting okay, because if you talk about the ancient Greeks, had seven words for different types of love.

Rachel Richards 14:48

And we use. We can say we fancy you. It's quite a limiting word and so, for example, eros was passion, lust, pleasure. Philia was kind of authentic, the stuff that great friendship is made of, and it can be platonic or it can be a romantic partner. So these lots of layers of love here. Ludus, which is the non-committal type of love where you can bandit with your friends, engaging in playful conversation, flirting, that would be Ludus Stork I think it's stork which is unconditional familial love, so the family level of love. Philotia, which is self-compassion, and that's nurturing yourself, cultivating self-awareness, honoring your own body and its needs. Pragma is love built on commitment and understanding and long-term interests, which probably comes in much later. And then Agape, which is altruism and pay it forward love, so it's like being selfless and doing things for a community. Again, that's not really a teenager's kind of territory. So it's actually really interesting breaking down the different types of love and going well you know, rather than controlling it.

Rachel Richards 15:58

So are they?

Susie Asli 15:59

in love, or are they not? Yeah, we have a problem with Eros and our teens, don't we?

Rachel Richards 16:02

The others are fine, yeah absolutely Absolutely, if we have a problem with it. I looked up some stats on it and fewer than 2% of people marry their high school sweetheart, and when teens do get married, only about half of them make it to their 10th year anniversary. Also, I read that, on average, relationships between 16 year olds tend to last about six months. 17 and 18 year olds about a year. Again, it's an average.

Susie Asli 16:28

So you know, and yeah, it's a time of experimentation, isn't it? In all areas, and particularly this one. So it's kind of it's a fluid time of I have these feelings, trying them out in a safe and appropriate way of course.

Rachel Richards 16:42

But I like that. You see, and I think it's the reason I'm talking about this is I think we really need to take a breath and think what is going on here, and there's some very, very important stuff going on. But if we force them to say, are you going to marry this person, oh my God, you know, there's an element of that of kind of locking people into. You know, no sex before marriage or no, which is fine If those are your values, you know that those are your values. But there's an element of people learning from having relationships. That is very important.

Susie Asli 17:11

Really important. It's like any relationship that teenagers go through, or children or any of us really, but you know siblings, we learn our boundaries, we learn all sorts of things through our siblings that we've talked about here before, and you know potential relationships. Whatever that looks like, it's like a playground of learning of how to communicate, how to you know how to even you know how do we kiss.

Rachel Richards 17:33

How do we?

Susie Asli 17:34

do these things, what do we do? And you know, talking about it with friends, talking about it with them. It's invaluable. Yes, and the minute, we bring shame into it or awkwardness, which it will be, because it's new and different and they, you know, by the nature of it it's a bit awkward with that age. It kind of it's a shame.

Rachel Richards 17:52

And I think it's a hyper learning experience. So we we learn every day. We learn about interactions and human behavior and things, but when you get into this sort of more relationship status with anybody, you're having to learn stuff really quickly, and I think it can be really beneficial. According to one research study, even after accounting for early relationship experiences with parents and peers, aspects of adolescent dating experiences predict romantic relationship qualities in young adulthood, and what they said in this was that adolescents who dated fewer partners in mid-teens and experience a better quality of dating relationship demonstrated romantic partner interactions that were smoother and had an easier relationships.

Rachel Richards 18:35

Yeah, and the converse is true, that if there was a lot of conflict in their early relationships and they dated a lot more partners, it can result in a more negative. Yeah, I'm sure that's right, and I had a friend whose daughter started a relationship as a teenager and it was just lovely because they both made a list of all the things they'd like to do and did them together, and so now you have someone by your side who's supporting you in trying out new things. Yeah, and these can be very, very positive things.

Susie Asli 19:05

And relationships are also. If you're struggling with yourself, then you're attracting a certain type of partner, so it's all connected to how we are in general in the world.

Rachel Richards 19:16

Yes, and it plants the seeds of self-sufficiency and independence from your parents too. So you start to kind of think how would I be if I'm not with my parents? If I'm not at home, how am I going to behave in the world?

Susie Asli 19:28

Who will I be attached to? Yes, and parents play a big role in that because, I mean, my experience was that my parents weren't very keen on me dating or doing anything with the opposite sex If that's your, you know your favour or having any kind of romantic or sexual relationship, and that was really problematic. That made it weird and that made it like secret and, yeah, that's not a great option either.

Rachel Richards 19:52

Yes, and then you're left thinking, well, is there something wrong with me? Or you're having to ally yourself with other kids who may not really be thinking this through either.

Rachel Richards 20:02

So, it is better to have parents who can talk to about this stuff. I think it can be hard for teens to take a long view or to step back and consider things calmly, and this lack of executive functioning can also lead to risky behaviour, which is why, again, you want to be inside the circle of safety with your teenager, being able to talk to them so you can guide them, rather than outside. There's a study to publish in the Journal of Adolescent Mental Health and the research has found that the early stages of teenage love have similar effects as hypomania, and that's the state of kind of abnormally elevated energy activity mood changes. It's a bit like bipolar disorder. When you are, this really excited stage, are we?

Susie Asli 20:44

not like that as adults.

Rachel Richards 20:46

I think we can be yes.

Navigating High School Relationships

Susie Asli 20:47

I think, I think falling in love is just an amazing experience. You've done it recently? Yeah, exactly, I mean, I'm just thinking well, that doesn't necessarily have to be a teenager. Maybe it's more exaggerated, and maybe it's more reckless when it's a teenager. And I think they don't have the executive function, but the feelings, you know, the euphoria, the endorphins, all of that is the same.

Rachel Richards 21:04

But I do think the difference is that for a teenager, it may well be the very first time they've ever experienced this, whereas as an adult, you will have coping mechanisms for going. Ok, I'm not going to completely divert my life in one direction just because I feel this way. There was a quote why do so many high school relationships fail and not really failing, Are they? No, they're just experiments, Because that's the thing when you start talking about a relationship failing that's the problem.

Rachel Richards 21:30

I looked at that and thought there you are. That's why we've got a problem with that.

Susie Asli 21:34

That's coming with a hypothesis that you go out with your 15 year old boyfriend and you are together forever, and if you don't, then bang fail. Yes, rubbish.

Rachel Richards 21:44

So the search for identity is a central task of being an adolescent right. So if you're in a relationship, you'll develop your identity and then you may well both be wanting different things, and this is normal Totally. And then you need to. That happened to my son. Yeah, you need to go off and find explore elsewhere, which is perfectly normal and wonderful.

Susie Asli 22:05

And absolutely the right thing to be doing because the alternative is staying together and it's wrong. I mean, why would you do that? Why would you do that?

Rachel Richards 22:12

And so advice for teens prioritizing getting to know yourself, because this is your job as a teenager is trying to work out who am I, what matters to me, and try to avoid the tendency to mold yourself to your current partner. I have a girlfriend who, every time she had a new boyfriend, would start his hobby. She had a wardrobe full of different things. Wow, yeah, like somebody who flew, somebody who's a DJ literally all the different she'd buy all the stuff.

Susie Asli 22:39

Yeah, it was really sweet.

Rachel Richards 22:42

Well, that's the thing, because actually you get to try all these new hobbies, but then you know, I then say, oh, how's the surfing? And she goes oh, I'm not doing that anymore. Yeah, has he gone. Yeah, I've just got a different one. We can all learn from that. Yeah, absolutely, make choices that are best for you. So again, this is like rather than trying to stay in the relationship, what's best for you, what are you trying to do with your life and keeping a balanced social life is critical because if they don't, if, if and when it doesn't pan out, they need that other network, they need that support.

Susie Asli 23:16

Don't think that's really important and I think that's very common, that we get so wrapped up in this amazing euphoric feeling of whatever that looks like for the teenager, that we then prioritise that over our friends, which is completely normal and it will happen, but it's really important to keep your friendship and prioritise that as well. Yes, I had that conversation with one of my kids and it's really important and it feels. It felt for him, it felt awkward because actually he did want to and she was pushing in a way that he was quite young and it was you know, it was all fine, but it's really really important. Suddenly, you're, you're not being who you are right.

Guidance for Teen Dating

Rachel Richards 23:55

Because you need your mates, and I love that, because what you were doing there as a parent was providing a backstop and saying so is this? Because it then gives them a little speed bump thing. Actually, is this the right thing for?

Susie Asli 24:06

you, yeah, I know just a few times and went Is that what you want? Yes, not really. Okay, well, let's work this out and we made we worked out.

Rachel Richards 24:15

I like that. So tips let them know they can talk to you about anything, and really about anything. Go back to the episode on how not to overreact, because that's really helpful. I learned a lot from that, and it's just about being able to sit and go. Okay, I feel uncomfortable about this, but that's okay, it doesn't matter. I just need to listen and help them think through things, validate and celebrate their experience. You know, for them it's really exciting. So if you sit there and go, oh, I don't think that's a good thing. All that's going to happen is they'll feel terrible about telling you anything.

Susie Asli 24:47

That's not going to help. And they are totally inexperienced. This is a new game and it's really, it's really difficult.

Rachel Richards 24:56

It's very difficult, encourage them to take their relationships offline, and I love this because one of our listeners really a long time ago, sally was saying you know, when we were talking about sexting, she said do you want to send a photo of your boobs to a boy on the basis that he may end up showing that to everybody in the school, or are you going to do things? Now? I'm not encouraging people to take their kids up to the bedroom. My point is that it's actually just it's so much more healthy to be spending time together. Text messages can be misconstrued. They can Amplify things that you didn't mean and it's much better to be together.

Susie Asli 25:31

In the technology there's a distance that exactly it's not real.

Rachel Richards 25:34

So, if they can take the, take the relationship offline and and you know, out of the, get the glare of the public as well you can, and protecting them from toxic teen relationships. Watch out for signs that indicate your teen isn't being treated right yeah so, you know, is that partner trying to control their behavior?

Rachel Richards 25:53

one or both teens are too jealous or overprotective. Bruises or injuries, with drawing from friends and family, which we talked about, frequent arguments these are all things that would make me think. Right, I need to step in and explain calmly and clearly why something doesn't look quite right and help them with it don't again. You don't want to step, like you were talking about that other time, where you know we step forward and they step back. So you want to just step forward for Jen, really gently.

Susie Asli 26:24

Seeing something. What do you think? Yeah, and have them over if they feel comfortable doing very different for different kids and all of that, but If you can get them over and meet them and make it normal, yes and normal friendship rather than who it's your boyfriend or your girlfriend and be weird about. Don't do that, my mother get to know them absolutely so, emma.

Rachel Richards 26:45

One of our listeners said exactly that. She said you can sniff out the duds. Really I love it. But also actually great stories and some. Some friends had a daughter who started dating a boy and the family invited not just her but her parents over, which was a really awkward evening, and then they broke up shortly after, so that was really uncomfortable. Yes, maybe just meet the child first before you want the parents. Yeah, yeah, I think that helping them staying connected and with their friends and everything can you know?

Susie Asli 27:17

make a massive difference, can't? They're already part of the same friendship group, then what? That has pluses and minuses, obviously, but it can if you might already know them. That's easier than, isn't it? Yes?

Rachel Richards 27:27

I remind them that real life dating isn't a movie.

Rachel Richards 27:30

Yeah, because it can be really confusing. Yes, not a wrong com. Yeah, it's not a wrong com. No, this is a good time to actually you can. We talked about this before. It's actually really valuable to express your, your beliefs and your values. It's not. You know, this isn't a bad thing, but actually forming hard barriers can be the problem. But actually saying we believe in having a deep connection with somebody or what is there's nothing wrong with that and talking through how you see things, but imposing it on them is where it becomes problematic you think, why don't?

Rachel Richards 28:06

agree, yeah, so allowing them to say well, I see this way yeah, what do you? Think yes, yes, and boundaries and expectations, put them in place. Yeah, you can if you don't like this kid, yeah right, you can have a conversation with your team. But just like the episode where we talked about what happens if you don't like their friends, same thing applies you just restrict access.

Susie Asli 28:24

Yeah, and you can voice concerns and then. But then go the other way, like we talked about in the other episode. You know, trying to get to know them, always, always, try to probably. There's probably always lots of lovely things about them too. I can have your reservations and checking your reservations are they? Are they real? Are they your old triggers?

Rachel Richards 28:45

yeah, absolutely and I said to my daughter you know, if you like that person, I'm gonna want to meet them because obviously there's something important there for you and I want to get to know what it is in a really, really positive way. Yeah, what about when their heart gets broken? I mean, they're going to get restless at some point. They may feel irritated or trapped, or you know that most of these relationships won't survive, but the worst thing we can do is minimize it.

Susie Asli 29:10

Yes, absolutely like with any feelings, there's nothing wrong with the feelings that they're real. They're absolutely real, and if we minimize it that's really painful for them.

Rachel Richards 29:19

Yes, so you know, don't you know the whole over more fish in the sea, or yeah, I didn't like them anyway.

Susie Asli 29:25

You're only 16.

Rachel Richards 29:27

It's not important. You wait till you're my age and we're divorcing. Yeah, no, I'm not getting divorced. By the way, one thing my daughter mentioned was she said, if your child is in a relationship and they're not telling you, you should be a bit concerned, because it's actually about how they feel about you if they're not prepared to tell you about it.

Susie Asli 29:51

I thought that was quite interesting. That is interesting. I do, however, think it's different, sometimes massive generalization coming up with boys and girls.

Rachel Richards 29:58

Interesting yes.

Susie Asli 30:00

I do think that in general boys are a little bit more private right, yeah, good point are particularly, maybe with their moms.

Rachel Richards 30:07

Yes, tell them everything, yeah.

Susie Asli 30:09

So maybe pinch a salt with the boys if they don't like it's not, doesn't necessarily mean there's a big, big issue yeah, they just aren't ready to tell you. Yeah, I might have pretty good about that, but I they're different from my daughter.

Rachel Richards 30:20

Yeah, now how to help your teens for a breakup. You don't have to find the right thing to say you just don't. You need to let them vent. Encourage them to talk with their friends. Help them establish a routine, because the routines will just get them through their days and get them because it takes time.

Susie Asli 30:36

Yeah, and try and be respectful as well. I think it can be really tempting to go into a big slanging match and and be kind of a bit disrespectful in general, but treats yes, you know, present partners and exes with respect.

Rachel Richards 30:50

I love that yes, and it's really important. You know you don't suddenly say all I didn't like what I just said. You don't suddenly Hate everything about them because you love things about them. So it's actually being respectful as you walk out of the door as well, and that's a really good lesson.

Susie Asli 31:06

I love that. All go and do that to him. He's an idiot kind of thing.

Rachel Richards 31:10

That's not cool yeah, it takes time to heal. Being single doesn't mean being alone, no-transcript, and you can and will feel love again but it's not going to happen immediately, so you just have to. Yeah, there are times you need to get help. If there's been several weeks and they're not getting over their feelings, they have persistent low moods, they've disengaged with their life and their friends, it might be worth getting some support whether that's the GP or any school counsellor. Let the school know if they can.

Susie Asli 31:45

They might be able to step in and give them some support and I think it's also really important. I was super impressed by one of my kids. He had a. It was a very brief relationship but being really courageous and if it's not working for you, then do the right thing.

Susie Asli 32:03

Or this is a really good one because it's very easy, just to do the whole ghosting thing and my son didn't, and he was only 15. I was so impressed off his own back and explained and said it's not working for me, etc. Etc. And knowing that she was more into it than he was and that's really important. It takes guts, though. I love that.

Rachel Richards 32:32

And that's where we, as parents, can coach our kids and say so it's okay, it's okay to not want to be with this person.

Susie Asli 32:41

That's fine, but out of respect for just it's another human being, they deserve to have something more than that, and it feels so much better for the person doing it as well, because it's clean, it feels honourable, as there's a dignity in it, rather than just sinking off and ghosting them. That doesn't feel nice for them either.

Rachel Richards 32:58

Although I did read this woman complaining about how she turned up to this date. She had done some stilettos, all her makeup and done her hair and they got to the restaurant and he said by the way, I actually don't want to be in this relationship anymore. And she said everyone says don't dump people on text, but actually I would have rather that, because he wasted my evening and I put all these yeah Right so well. I think that's it for teenage relationships. Like everything, we can make a massive difference by being the person who lets them think through how they feel Right. It's just like trying to nudge them to help them see what the particulars are. It can give them a huge amount of mental distress if they can't think clearly about the issues, and so we need to be that space.

Susie Asli 33:43

Yeah, or at least be the space that we can pick up the pieces afterwards.

Rachel Richards 33:46

Pick up the pieces, yeah. And it's normal life, isn't it? Yeah, we all wish we didn't have to go through heartbreak, but it will happen. If you have any feedback, you can reach us at teenagersuntangled at gmailcom. Hit the follow button on your app, or give us some stars, or even leave a review. Yes, all these things will help us. Yeah, yeah, just tell everybody. Anyway, you can find more on the website, at wwwteenagersuntangledcom, and find us on Instagram, twitter, linkedin. We are still finalists for the Independent Podcast Award. We are.

Susie Asli 34:20

We are still. We haven't heard yet. So exciting.

Rachel Richards 34:23

Susie has. She's very on LinkedIn. You're really LinkedIn to LinkedIn, aren't you?

Susie Asli 34:27

Because you're quite. You've got a corporate size as well In phases. That's got some corporate stuff at the moment. Yeah, she's been. They're quite fun. They're all after her. Do you go? And so popular, yes.

Rachel Richards 34:38

So you can nudge her there. Her website where you can actually have a proper conversation.

Susie Asli 34:42

Yeah, it's wwwmindful-lifecouk.

Rachel Richards 34:48

And you won't have to listen to me rambling Straight to the horses mouth Classes and minuses with all of these things. So yeah, you can have a 15 minute free conversation.

Susie Asli 35:00

Yeah, pretty chat with me. What's Couldn't you know? It's better than that.

Rachel Richards 35:03

What could go wrong? That's it for now. I'll speak soon. Bye, bye, fena.