Transcript
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Hello and welcome to teenagers untangled the audio hug for parents going through the teenage years. I'm Rachel Richards, mother of two teenagers and two bonus daughters.
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Hi, I'm Suzy Asli, mindfulness coach, mindful therapist, and musician and mother of three teenagers, two of them are twins.
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Now most of us by now have some experience of serious illness or death, whether it's a loved one or a friend or even a pet. But our teenagers are just setting out on life and having to support them through thinking about illness and death in the family can really be incredibly tricky for us adults. One thing I did read that I thought was fascinating was a quote by Jeanne Denny, who's a psychotherapist and death educator in Wisconsin, she said, there's this longing among young people to connect with death.
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And teenagers often want to discuss and ask questions, but they recognize that it can be a taboo subject, even with or maybe especially with their parents.
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Yeah, I think that's really critical, isn't it? I think as a society as a culture, we are, we are not very good at discussing death, we will. I can't speak for everybody. But the majority are quite frightened of death, the idea of death. So we push it away. We don't want to talk about it. And of course, they pick up on that
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They pick up on it. And there's a fantastic book called Smoke Gets In Your Eyes, which is actually black humor.
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And it was written by a woman who worked in a crematorium. And she talks about the way that our culture has changed in its attitude towards death, where we used to really embrace it; it used to be something where you would have weeks and the whole family would come or the entire family community would come around and it would just be very, very much so they held that safe space and now it's completely hidden.
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Yeah. And it's really sanitized. And I think there's some changes as well. I think the idea of death doulas is is a growing thing, because there's a feeling of missing the the sort of earthiness the groundedness because death is part of life.
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Yes, absolutely. Now, before embarking on this topic, shall we talk about your nugget?
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Yeah, I've got a nugget today, which is something that's cropped up in our family before, but it came to a bit of a head. And I have twins, one of them is a girl, one of them is a I love that. Because I think quite often as parents, when we boy, the boy is very sociable, and he's an extrovert. So he gets a lot of energy from hanging out with his friends, and likes doing that a lot. And my daughter, she has a lovely group of friends. But she's an introvert and she really appreciates and prioritizes often recharging, which means doing her own thing, having a quiet space going to a room. And one particular evening I was going out. She had planned in her head it was a few days before school, she had some art homework, she needed to finish.
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So she was going to be in the kitchen and be in a room chilling with a dog in her pajamas, like really lovely. And my son had other plans, which involved inviting lots of people around and having them here. So about eight of them when they went to becoming girls and boys.
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And my daughter was horrified because she didn't know in advance. And this ruined her plans like how could she possibly do her art quietly in the kitchen with you know, eight people cooking pizza around in her pajamas. So how do we solve that, and added to the mix of that was that and I really felt it in this this occasion that I have a value, which is that. And I say it to my to my kids that their friends are always welcome. That's really important to me. Whether they come or not, that's you know, fine, but they're always welcomed, the door is open, because I think that's really important for me anyway. So I couldn't just kind of, you know, say, Oh, well, you know, your daughter, my daughter wants this. So you can't have your friends kind of thing that felt also felt wrong. So how do we solve this one. So we turned it into a really good exercise in empathy. Which is, you know, they didn't get the other person they really, especially my son who's he doesn't get the idea that you need to recharge because he's always bounces back. He gets loses energy when he's not with his mates. So how was that a thing? So trying to get him to understand that actually, you don't actually you don't have to really get it, but you need to hear it. You need to put yourself in my daughter's shoes. And then you know, hear it and take that in and the way you can and then respect it.
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It's not right or wrong. It's just her experience. And same for my daughter. She didn't quite get it why does he always have to have people around? And you know, that that is his experience. It's not right or wrong. It's different from yours and there's a respect in it. And they kind of got it. It took a little while they got it and the idea that you know we have different needs and we also can't always get what we want.
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So you can't both have what you want. Then how can we make it work, but the empathy part was was the most important that it was really good.
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see a dispute like that, we feel that we just need to adjudicate and make a decision. If, instead you used that in a really effective way to help them grow, which is so powerful, yeah. And it was annoying for them. Can't you just, you know, tell him not to? No I can't, let's work this out together.
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And they did compromise, and it did work out.
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I love it. I love it. I met up with my daughter on Sunday, and nobody else was there. So the rest of my family were off doing their own things. And we just sat around in the sunshine, cup of tea. And we had no time limits, and we had no agenda. And it was amazing, because I was really excited for her because she just run her personal best. And we just chatted about life, the universe and everything and caught up. And it was only after we'd been chatting for, you know, half an hour or so that she said, thre's this thing that's really been bugging me and, she said, I want your advice. And of course, my brain instantly went, Oh, jump on the next track 'advice mode'. And then I noticed myself doing it and thought Rachel, what have you learned from doing this podcast, you don't do that because it's not helpful to anybody. So I stuck my brain back on the super silence path.
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And this is one of the techniques we talked about, really right at the start in one of the early episodes. And it's this either super silence or active listening. And so all I did was I just held the space.
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And when she was explaining, I'd say I can see, I empathize, I can see how that would be really hard. And that sounds really normal because it was really normal. And, then whenever she got stuck with something, I just said, Well, is it this? Or is it this? And that gave her an option where she could say, well, no, it's neither of those things. But it gave her a way of kind of, she'd got stuck on the path. But what was amazing was she unfolded everything herself.
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She did all the work. And all I needed to do was just feed back to her that how I it seemed normal, amazing. And you know, at the end of it, she said, Oh my goodness, I'm so grateful.
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I've got someone I can talk to you like this. And I think she really is, you're really lovely for her. I say yes. And I think we all need that. And actually providing that for them, gives them a chance to really fix these problems themselves, rather than than letting them all
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build up. And I love that you the you know, the thing that I bang on probably the most in anything I do is awareness.
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It's like noticing, oh, I've gone into problem solving. You know, that's the normal responses. And it's normal, right? Especially with our kids.
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What's wrong, I need to fix this. But awareness, oh, look, I've gone into that pattern. And then you have a choice as to whether you do or don't go down that route.
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And it takes quite a while for that to evolve. And it has taken a while but I feel comfortable now. So back to the topic of life limiting illness. And one of the reasons I brought that up is because this is actually really important in this sphere. Do you have any personal experience this?
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I don't, luckily, I'm very fortunate in that. My children also haven't experienced losing anybody I have professionally. So I have clients who who go through these kinds of issues, but not in my personal life.
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Right. So for me I've had breast cancer and it was found very early, I didn't need any further treatment other than the operation of medication. I have been through a scanxsociety, they call it where you knew you feel anxiety about scans coming up beforehand, and afterwards waiting for the results. So this is a very common experience for people who have anything like this can because you're on a different medical track now.
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Talking to my teens was the hardest thing for me. And it was more to do with I was scared for them. So I waited until I had enough information, but not very long. because one of the first questions was when did you know?
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I was very clear, I told him exactly what stage it was what type of cancer it was what I knew everything I knew, because they wanted information. And when they could look at me, they cried and I held that space for them. And when they looked at me they knew that I had been honest with them. And I think that is one of the top tips from everything I read from people who've been through this and people who've suffered it themselves. It's so important that you we have to be honest and clear and deliberate about that.
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Well people do but particularly teenagers, they have their antenna out anyway and if what's coming out of your mouth isn't in alignment with what they're picking up on. Then they then they get really confused yes
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telling me? And then the anxiety rises. So they can calm down and they know that you're going to tell them, and then they don't have to worry because they can trust you.
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Okay, well, I can just wait, they will tell me. And I've only had that limited experience. I'm very grateful that it wasn't traumatic. I've had some amazing feedback from one friend whose husband died with four children.
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And my bonus daughters have been through this. And I've got a friend who's currently dealing with this. So these are all people who have given me some just wonderful advice that hopefully can help other people who are going through this. And I just want to dedicate this to Sophie, who's going through this right now. And I think she's doing an amazing job. Jeanne Danny, who's a psychotherapist and death educator says the kids who do the best, have an outlet.
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And as their parent, you can model that for them. So kids who encounter a death without any discussion or education may imprint that experience as trauma. And you've been working with trauma, haven't you?
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Yeah, I am qualified, and I've done courses in trauma and understanding trauma. And I, just recently, actually, last week did a webinar in a workplace on understanding trauma, but it's can be applied to life in general. And it's, it's such an important topic. And traditionally we saw trauma as something only a few people experience like soldiers coming back from war with PTSD or you know, being in an earthquake or a warzone or a kidnapping. And now, it's recognized that that's not what it is. Trauma is not so much what happens to you, is what happens inside of you as a result of what happens to you.
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So it's when we can't process and integrate - it's not so much the event. It's what goes on inside you. So can you process it? Can you integrate it and without judgment? So you know, it can be sparked by watching a car accident or something that we might have judged mentally earlier, gone. Oh, that's not trauma. That's not serious enough. Yes. That doesn't mean it doesn't matter. It's it's, it's how do you how are you integrating it? How are you processing? Yes, absolutely.
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And, your parent being ill, will feel traumatic. It's normal, that's common, and you can, you know, get help with that. Yes,
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My friend whose husband died, said that the older ones found it much harder, the teenagers found it harder than the younger ones. But that's just because they understood more about what was going on. And that was those particular teenagers. So they will all respond in their own ways. And it's very difficult to give you an indication of how this is going to pan out.
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And children understand death, in different processes in their developmental lives. So you know, young children will come and ask about death and understand it on one level, and then maybe they'll come back to you two years later. And you might think we've done that topic, because they have a different understanding now of the world and the universe in general. And suddenly, that simple version of events doesn't fit anymore. So they need to have more questions. So for teenagers, they have a much more complex understanding of the world and the universe. So they will have a more complex understanding of death, and it will affect them in a different way.
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Absolutely. So I think one of the big questions people have is, how do you start this conversation? My friend said, don't force a conversation, they will come, they will come to you to ask you questions, if they feel safe talking about it. So it's about letting them know that there'll be no judgement, whatever you're thinking is, safe. There's nothing that's off limits. I think one thing that can help us is to normalize death for yourself, sometimes you don't have time to do that. But just generally as, as just a human being, I honestly advise, it's wonderful to read about death.
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Whether you've got an elderly parent who will be dying at some point, just understanding this process can be so helpful in advance. And I wish I'd done this before my mother died, for example.
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So important, and as a culture we are, we are generally really awful at it, we push it away, we sanitize it, we like, we kind of think we're going to live forever. We don't we know we're not we know in our heads, we're not but we don't really want to deal with the idea that we're not because it's terrifying. So we push it away.
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And that obviously ripples out to our kids. The one of the big sort of pillars in existential psychotherapy is the idea that if we fully understand that we're going to die, and by that I don't mean just in your head, but you fully understand and integrate the idea that you are going to die, then you live differently. And the cliche is people who have been through some sort of awful illness or accident or something like that, and then they go, Oh, my goodness, I've got a new chance and I'm now going to do all the stuff I want to do. I'm now going to shave away all the superfluous stuff that I don't want to do anymore. And the idea of the existential psychotherapy is, you know, wouldn't it be amazing and great if we all did that now. But you have to really understand that, yeah, we're all going to die.
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I think it's hard because I know that when I had cancer, it did flip that switch, and I thought, wow, I've got an excuse now. And it's almost like the societal expectations, you need to be this until you've got sick. And then you can say, oh now I can do what I want. Yeah, as a society, we need to let people just be whatever.
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Or we can just not wait for society to give us permission, we can just do it ourselves.
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So I did. I've put some books in the podcast notes that I found really useful. I've read quite a few of them. And they're just amazing ways of actually accessing this.
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There's also a podcast about death and dying that's in there that's designed to help people.
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I think the language is important. So again, euphemisms are really unhelpful, particularly with teenagers.
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Because what do you mean? I mean, you just have to say, they're never going to get better. But you do need to be clear. Yeah. Because if you don't, if you're not clear, and then suddenly, the person gets very, very sick. And they've been okay, then the teenager is gonna go, Well, wait, you didn't map that out for me. I didn't know. Yeah, so. And it's a very difficult one. So we will go into why that's so difficult.
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And when you talk about it it's okay to ask them what they do and don't understand about the illness. So just try and get feedback. And finding time when you have full attention. So it can either be something where you're both doing an activity you both quite enjoy. And it's relaxed, it's not stressful, or where you can literally just stop and talk to them, because they will have questions. And don't be afraid to use language that's their language, for example. Yes, it really sucks.
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It sucks that mommy's sick, it's painful, I just feel terrible about it. And I wish it wasn't this way. And they'll understnad that's okay to feel that,
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They'll prefer your human response rather than when you're trying to and,
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My friend says don't be afraid to cry and show your emotions. They want to put their arms around you, they want to show they love you, the grief is love. And being able to make you cups of tea or look after you and take over the cooking for the family. Or
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maybe their response is that they're really, really angry, and they run away, and I can't deal with it. And that's okay. That can be challenging for the parent, obviously, you don't know, we don't know how our kids will respond to anything.
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And I'll just briefly mention, that thing you shouldn't do is if you're not actually directly involved in that situation. So let's say you're one of the teachers or you're one of their friends and family. Don't fall apart in front of this teenager, because if somebody in their family who's a rock is going through this, the last thing they need is all the other adults around them falling apart. They need you to hold that space so that they can fall apart.
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And there's a very big difference between holding compassionate space for the teenager and maybe you know, shedding a tear and really, you know, really feeling it's must be awful for them like truly or, and in showing them that and falling apart. There's a difference.
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There's a big difference. Yeah. Watching movies can be very helpful, because there are quite a few films that it doesn't have to be about illness or death. But actually, there are films even Disney films where this has been touched on. And then it can spark conversation,
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There are loads of films and music and art and books because we don't like talking about death. So we put it in our art.
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Yes, it's all out there now. So coming on to this specific thing about teenagers and I got this from my bonus daughter, who was so helpful. Peer groups are super important at this developmental stage, which we know. And sometimes your teen is going to seem like they're not responsive. There are some teens who will be there. And it may be that they just want to process it with their friends. My bonus daughter hated all adults, and didn't want to talk to them. And she was fortunate at the time because she had friends who were suffering or struggling with similar things. And she had compassionate friends who she could talk to about it, which was so helpful for her. But then again, it can also be common that teens are the only person in their peer group who have this issue, and that can be very isolating. Yeah. So understanding how critically important peer relationships become when they're teenagers can give you a lot more empathy, which we were talking about earlier for why they might behave in any particular way they're behaving.
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And also getting information like is really shocking. And there's a grief in that life will never be the same again. And there's a grief in that. So they may just, you know, need to shut down for a bit or they're in shock, or there may be lots of different reactions.
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And I think one of the things you can do to take a little bit of weight off is to reassure them, that their needs will be met, whether their physical, mental, emotional, spiritual, that they need to know that because what happens, and this is a fascinating thing I've been thinking about is, once you are diagnosed with something that's a serious illness, or regardless of how bad it is, so mine was really minor compared to what some people deal with, you're now on a different medical track, you're no longer free, you're now always going to have to refer back to that thing, and get treatment for that thing, and go to hospitals, talk to Consultants is it's a whole new world. So if you are somebody who has intimate knowledge of that particular thing, then you might be useful to that person.
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But trust me, if somebody is going through this, they have read every single book they can possibly find on this, they've stayed up all night reading it on the web. So whatever sort of lay by idea you have, may not be very helpful.
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So that comes from often from stress and fear, and people want to take it away.
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We all do it.
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And it's an it comes from a place of love. But I've seen people raging saying, can you please not give me advice on how I should grieve and what I'm feeling because, because it's not helpful. If you have had this specific experience, I'm all ears, and I'm reaching out to you. But please don't, you know, minimize what's going on for me by trying to make yourself feel better. So this is this is one of those problems that we all struggle with,
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would you like to hear this, I've got this idea.
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And then if they say no then back off
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exactly. When I've talked to friends about this, they often hear people say, Oh, you're so brave, and you're so strong. And they say, Well, I'm not, I'm just someone who is stuck in a nightmare I can't get out of, I wake up every day, and I have to deal with what I've got. And you can call that brave or strong. I just call that living. And, yes, and, and so what you can do that's incredibly useful is, again, holding that space and saying, I'm really sorry for that is, you know, and you can say is there anything you can do, but often they can't come up with something because they're too traumatized by what's going on. So changes in life are very stressful. You changed schools, you've changed jobs, you change housing, or whatever, it's all stressful, this is stressful, because there's a big change. So the one thing you can do, that can really help is the stuff that keeps things normal. So how are the kids getting to school?
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How, how are they getting fed in the evening, all those little things that become really arduous. So so one of my one of my friends said that she needed to be with her husband, for all day appointments in the hospital. And it's very hard to then help your children if that's what's going on. So the friends around can step in with very realistic things like cooking, helping with, you know, structure regimes homework, can they come around to my house, can we give you lifts all that so they can keep going to their sports, so they can keep their life as normal as possible?
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Those are the things that we as onlookers can really do that can make a big difference. And my friend said, she took all the help that was offered anything that somebody offered.
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For teenagers, that is what they think about.
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Primarily. Absolutely. Like what you tell them something and even if it's not something as difficult as this, it could be something else. Well, who's gonna pick me up? 100%? Who's making the dinner? 100%? And it can seem a little bit like, well, is that all you can think about?
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No, I'm really ill here. Yeah. That is there.
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Well, how am I gonna?
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How are we going to manage this? So it's really important that that's covered.
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Absolutely. So that's, this is the way we have to step into their world briefly and go, Okay, what can now the other thing that's really, really helpful is we do have to teen tag with the schools. So there's school teachers and the welfare office and everybody needs to understand what's going on. And you need to find a point of contact where they can take the information and make sure everybody knows what's what's happening. And, and at each stage, because every time something happens, it can be, again, a shift at home. So what happened the really helpful things that happened was daughter's being allowed to leave lessons when they needed to go out and get some fresh air. You know, one teacher actually helped this woman son with his homework and gave him an opportunity to talk about how he was feeling with my bonus daughter. She said that she really acted out sheet her Fear turned into anger and, and being very difficult. And she said the school was amazing at understanding that this was not her being a bratty teenager that this was something else. And she said, a few blind eyes returned.
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Yeah, amazing. But if they're still pushing the boundaries, they kept the back. Because this is this is one of the difficult ones, because it can be very tempting when they're really struggling to just let off all the boundaries, or you can have you know, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter. So we still need to give them safe boundaries.
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But we also need to ease off it like homework. Yeah. And just say to them, can you let your teachers know that you're just not going to be able to reason
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when people are experiencing something traumatic, which it is? Very much. So they go into, you know, stress response, fight, flight freeze, and, you know, sounds like she went into a fight. And just having that understanding.
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So a trauma informed workplace school wherever is having that understanding that that is their survival response. And it's not a personal attack, it's not a, they can't actually they're not choosing it, it's just happening. Or it might be flight, it might be freeze. And as you've just said, really well, you know, that we can also have nurturing boundaries within that. So just because you're in fights doesn't mean all behavior is okay. But we have an understanding why you why you're having it. So it's a very different space.
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Yes. So rather than suspending them, you actually say you should have the boundaries.
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At home, exactly.
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Please don't hit so and so again, whatever you just, it's very different.
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And what we can do is consider the roles the parent or the important person has been fulfilling. So let's say it's a father, and you have sons, are there any other father figures that can step in and give them some guidance and support? Not not replace them, it's just having another man that you can talk to or, you know, whatever the person used to serve as the breadwinner of the family, your teenager is going to be well aware that this like, what's happening, what's happening with the house? Well, are we going on holiday, again, where we, you know, all those things, and they may not be thinking them consciously. So one of the things I thought that was really useful was, you can actually have a family meeting, and just talk about the logistics, if you've got teenagers. Don't shy away from having a family meeting and saying, what are your concerns?
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You know, what? So so let's look through the bills, the bills will be paid? Don't worry, you know, we're not going to move home. We're not or maybe we are, but we let's talk about the sorts of adjustments we're going to make if you have the capacity to do that. Yeah. But it can be very helpful for them to feel included.
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Yeah. And they will be having these thoughts anyway.
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So it's really, really reassuring for them. And super challenging for the parent going through it. I mean, like, I can't even imagine that kind of conversation. It must be so difficult. Yeah. So also, you know, I imagine getting some support, if you need, you're talking about it in another space, then you're you can have that conversation. Yes.
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And support is, is the vital thing to reach out for now. My friends did this amazing job of reaching out to people they realize they need to support from other people in the community, whatever community you're in, you've unfortunately joined even though you didn't want to there are people who can provide so much support. And I'll put some of the websites you know Winston's wish, for example, but there are lots and lots of organizations now who were there ready to answer phone calls? If you need some advice?
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You need somebody to back you up on something or just just somebody you can talk.
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Yeah, cuz the emotional roller coaster is just vast.
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And in terms of theatre, coming back to the behavior in some, some act out, there's there's a, there's a really interesting thing, the way grief works. And again, please don't look at someone go oh, you in this stage. So going, I've seen people raging about this, but there is anticipatory grief. So if it's catastrophic, and they've lost their parents or something, that's just, that's what it is. And then you're having to go through that entire process very quickly. But when someone's ill, for a long time, there's this whole grief of the little things that they're losing. And so each time this happens, this can happen.
00:29:11.220 --> 00:30:05.099
Again, a new, a new impact and talking about it is really helpful. So my friend said, look, they know, they know that I'm not going to be there when they get married. And actually acknowledging that and talking about giving them a space to say, well, this is what I'd like and this is how it might be and then you saying oh I would do this. And and I saw one woman say when my parent was was dying. They didn't talk to me about how long it was going to take. And I actually had much longer than I thought because nobody explained it to me. So then I just went into trauma mode and I was just kind of are rather than actually enjoying the time that I had with my parent where we could have made some memories you could have done lovely things which is what my friends have done just unbelievably well. I mean, I look at how they've managed this. And it's, it's phenomenal.
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And it's those. So it's so sounds extraordinary. Your friends. Yes, absolutely brilliant. So, you know, doing little cooking things together, playing cards together all those little things where you can talk about the stuff you're going to miss. Because we don't want to talk about that, do we? And I know from personal hearing it Yes. And from personal experience of dealing with this, one of the first things they'll think about when you say, I am going to die, is they'll think that their brain will quite possibly jump forward to all the things, those moments in life getting their driving license, getting your first job getting what any? Well, the teenage
00:30:41.970 --> 00:30:55.109
brain, I mean, particularly for most of us, as humans does, but for a teenager, particularly. And the world revolves around them. Yes. In an area. I'm not meant to be like, that's how they'll process this as well. Yes, yes.
00:30:55.410 --> 00:31:20.279
So. And so Sophie's been incredible, and her boys can come to her. And she said, You know, one night she had one of her sons come and sit and said, I'm really excited about the future. Can I talk to you about it? And he's planning his university, and he's excited about technology and things. And she said, it's painful. But how lucky Is she that she's got a son who can come and talk to her? And how lucky is he?
00:31:20.400 --> 00:31:21.480
He She sounds?
00:31:23.369 --> 00:31:58.619
What a woman Wow. Listen to this really interesting man who had dealt with his wife dying. And he said, almost up until the last moment, I had two tracks in my mind. One was she is going to get better. And we're going to live a fulfilling life. And the other track was she's dying. And he said, both of those coexisted. Yeah, I actually could literally think both things at the same time. And this is how our brains can compartmentalize and work. So I thought that was fascinating.
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And I think with teams, you know, there's lots going on. But as far as they're concerned, you know, I'm invincible. And so we have to remember that and that they, you know, they may well push boundaries that aren't safe. Yeah. So again,
00:32:13.319 --> 00:32:33.210
part of our brain as we always hope, but I imagine also, for some teenagers, and I think I've heard about this as well, is that for some that will put them into a fear spiral. So some of them will think they're invincible, and that's how they are, but some of them, oh, God, if they can die, then what about me? Yes. And that can then can go the other way?
00:32:33.390 --> 00:32:43.529
Yes, they're really good point. They, and they can mask emotions. Now, one of the other things about teens is they don't like to stand out.
00:32:40.470 --> 00:33:32.250
And it depends on the age, sort of, you know, often the younger ones, particularly, but they want to be part of the tribe, we've seen them all trying to wear the same clothes, or whether you know, they want to fit in somewhere. And this marks them out, this might make them feel different. So it's really important that we don't make them feel guilty for showing nothing, or seeming very sperrys selfish. Being very volatile in their emotions. You know, it's it's very hard for 12 to 14 year old to be able to take other people's perspectives into account even older as you as you've witnessed, and this is this is normal. But if you think your team is is very volatile, or they're really shut down, and you've been doing these things where you're trying to make an open environment, it's worth trying to seek proper help. Yes, so that they have
00:33:32.250 --> 00:34:01.170
a space looking someone. And also something that I have, I know about what I've also learned firsthand from, from my kids is, you know, telling them, you know, you can always talk to me, and you know, I'm always here, you can say whatever you like, they hear that they appreciate that they like it, but they don't know where to start. Yeah, maybe particularly boys, and maybe sexist. But so giving them little nuggets of you know, do you feel sad? Do you feel angry, like really breaking it down? So I feel this? Yes.
00:34:01.200 --> 00:34:04.170
I've been feeling this. I'm just wondering if you're feeling that. Yeah.
00:34:04.170 --> 00:34:14.010
So there's something tangible, they can talk about that and go no, and shut it down? Because maybe they just don't want to talk that maybe they are. Yes, I have all this stuff. I don't know what to say.
00:34:14.670 --> 00:34:41.429
Like, really specific, and an absolute NO, NO, which I've been told about is where we don't we feel uncomfortable. So what we do is we try to minimize our feelings by reassuring them. And that can be as bad as what happened in one person's case where people were saying, Oh, well, at least it's not. So I know, my friend.
00:34:38.940 --> 00:35:00.000
My friend's dad committed suicide. Or, you know, and this is literally some of the things people say, and they didn't mean to me uncaring, but they're saying things that are really unhelpful. Yes. And if you can't say anything, and to say just hold that space and just say, I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry.
00:34:57.539 --> 00:35:01.500
That's it. That's enough. That's enough you don't just enough
00:35:02.550 --> 00:35:03.389
how you doing now I
00:35:03.389 --> 00:35:08.130
wanted to just quickly touch on really positive things you can do, which again, I've been told about cookbooks.
00:35:08.340 --> 00:35:58.739
So Sophie is an amazing cook, she loves cooking with her sons or sons or turning into amazing cooks. And she's creating cookbooks, each boy, oh, when she's writing them herself with their favorite recipes, things they do together, what an incredible and I hope he doesn't mind me sharing that with everyone because of the fact is that this is one of those. And they will be able to touch the handwriting and it will be something that they can keep and cherish and is, she got something like that from her family. So this is the kind of these are ways that we can pass on are loved. And another friend has a book of memories of her husband, where she got literally everyone he knew she hijacked one of his email chains, got every single person he knew and said, Can you just give me some memories. And, and I'm doing this too, because there will be lots and lots of little snippets in there that get lost. Yeah.
00:35:58.829 --> 00:36:06.840
And actually having them written down, put together in a boot a book and read to the person will bring back wonderful memories.
00:36:06.869 --> 00:37:54.000
It gives people something to focus their emotion on. So when people sit there and say, I don't know what to do to show this person, I love them, share your memories, and and put them all in a book. And then the children have something that's tangible. And my friend who has this, she says the book moves around the house, everyone still opens it reads bits from it. So isn't that just amazing. And a memory box I also saw was a good one where you can just stick in a little special film you'd enjoy together photos, letters, poems, bits of hair, pictures, cards, anything that's meaningful. And they can each create their own little memory box of those moments that were very special, that they can open touch. And then just finally touching on the end of life, my friend told me that when her husband was given two weeks to live, which is a very difficult stage. She just basically said to her kids, you decide you can go into school, you can stay at home, you do what you want to do. And the only thing is, at what point do you tell your teenager that this is going to be the end? And this is this is really important, because the truth is even the doctors can't really tell you? No, nobody really, really knows. And when you say when you focus on the worst case scenario, you it kind of you lose all your hope. So people do try to focus on the best case scenario. And the difficulty is you run the risk that your teenager is gonna say, Well, you didn't tell me. Yeah, and you can't. So again, being open and saying they don't know, nobody knows, when my mother was dying. She was saying, Well, how long is it going to take? And I was saying, I don't know, I don't know. And this is the difficulty. And
00:37:54.000 --> 00:37:57.750
that's harder for a teenager hasn't it? Because they want to know, specifically.
00:37:58.440 --> 00:38:36.599
And so my friend's husband didn't want to be alone, she invited every single friend, he had to come round to the house, anytime drop him whenever they wanted. And she said it was amazing, because he was scared about being at home in a hospital bed. And just the community, the doctor was coming in washing up, you know, people were eating cake, I bringing in food. And she said it was like the United Nations in there. People flew in how it made, I wanted to share that because I want people to know that this can be awful, but it can also be incredibly life affirming. And, and a time when you're not all just struggling.
00:38:32.519 --> 00:39:01.050
Yeah. So it depends on how people so one of the reasons reading those books is really useful is because it gives you a chance to think about what you want. And there are people who will fight to their very last breath, you will say give me some more medicine give me I want to get, you know, they will ask for everything. And there are other people will say very early on, they'll say just give me palliative care. I don't you know, I want this to be the nicest. Okay, so So you just have to do what you do. But that's a lovely way of dealing with it.
00:39:01.860 --> 00:39:13.260
And you know, you never also know how your kids are going to respond. Some of them, you know, be react in a way that that is difficult for you to process or difficult for you to cope, but they maybe need to go down that road. And it just
00:39:13.260 --> 00:39:40.380
made me think that maybe your daughter would hate that scenario given that she doesn't like people. But your son would go great. So actually, this is the big problem, isn't it? Every bit people deal with things differently. So if you only take one thing from this conversation, it's that open honesty is the most important thing we can offer our teenager give them space where they can just talk and and let them know that it's okay. Whatever they're feeling,
00:39:40.440 --> 00:39:46.739
yeah. And they will be feeling like yes, at some point that it's so unfair. Yes.
00:39:43.260 --> 00:39:47.369
And it's really unfair. Like why should they?
00:39:47.519 --> 00:39:49.769
And that's okay to say that it's totally Yeah.
00:39:49.980 --> 00:39:58.050
And you say so once I rage Yes, yeah, yes. If you found this helpful, please do share it.
00:39:55.380 --> 00:40:15.510
Follow the podcast so you don't miss anything. And if you don't have The time to review us just give us a star rating. It helps other people find us. We're on Instagram and Facebook. And you can read more on our website and also research through the old episodes. So if there's something that you're interested in, it's probably there. Suzy has her own website, which is
00:40:15.539 --> 00:40:20.010
www dot a mindful hyphen Life dot code at UK.
00:40:20.460 --> 00:40:44.760
She's got really great techniques for helping through all sorts of different stages in life. And you can message her on Instagram, you can contact her directly, book an appointment, you don't have to pay it's just like it start off by just talking to her about and she'll tell you I can help you with that or here's where you might like to go. Exactly. That's very helpful. And she's friendly.
00:40:44.849 --> 00:40:50.460
She's right, that's it. Bye bye for now. Bye bye for now.
