Transcript
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Hello and welcome to Teenagers Untangled the audio hub for parents going into and through the teenage years. I'm Rachel Richards.
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I'm Susie Asli,
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and today we're going to talk about holidays and how to survive them.
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She says giggling
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we we've had some great feedback and tips from parents and an insight into some of the frustrations. I got messaged on Instagram. Kirsty really wants guidance on how to get them off electronics. Yes, it's a classic one and Frankie says her teen sleeps through breakfast and always is on catch up with food and then out of sync with everyone else's mealtimes. Yep, I've been through that. I completely understand that situation. I had that with my bonus daughter in particular. We'll talk about that later. Anyway,
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given up with that one.
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We're talking about dealing with sleep, electronics, how to plan, accepting the teenage brain and making the most of how they work, and giving yourself a break too.
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Like that sounds good.
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But Susie, we've had loads of reviews. What have you got there?
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Well, this is just the loveliest review that really actually resonates with me.
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Particularly. It says it's called Safe Haven. I am a therapist for trauma and PTSD recovery working with adults.
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And yet I do find myself lost and unequipped when I am dealing with my 17 and 15 year old boys.
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Why? Because I stop being a therapist, I am a scared mother trying to navigate parenthood.
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And you ladies are my support, my guidance, my clarity, much love. What a beautiful review.
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And that really resonates because you know, it's very different with your own kids.
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And it's important, because I was talking to someone recently who was telling me their problem. There was a mother and a father. And I said, oh, so here are some techniques you can use. And he stopped me and he said, Hey, wait a second. Don't you use these techniques at work? And she said, Yeah, I do all the time. We talk about this all the time. But because you're out of work mode and into panicked mother mode, you don't think about it that way.
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And we get massively triggered by our kids. It's a very different space.
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So here's another one, episode 46, which I think was the biggorexia - boys eating everything in your house.
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Thank you for this light hearted creative approach to such an important topic. Teenage boys have always been susceptible to working out but post COVID and tech, the pressure has gone through the roof. That's from St. Angeles on Spotify. And again, that's a new issue that a lot of people don't know about.
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But it's really important to be aware of it. Now, Suzy, what nuggets have you got for us?
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today, I have a hopeful story for people who have siblings that argue when they're younger. Because mine have become really great friends now. I have three kids, and two of them particularly did not get on. My daughter and my eldest boy, they wouldn't mind me saying that. We laugh about it quite a lot now. And they're just, I don't know, they just all get on. And they were away together at their dads for a big chunk of the holiday and they came back. And then we've sort of been dipping in and out. And they all reunited. So when we went on holiday with another of our family in Ireland, they just looked genuinely really happy to see each other and they were hanging out. And my mother heart just melted because I did wonder, you know, when they were younger? Oh my god. And I did say to them, you're really similar; these two in particular. And I think you'll be really good friends when you're older, which they of course told me. No, I won't.
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I'll hate her forever. And they don't. So hang in there. It's really beautiful.
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I love your positive stories. Yeah, just that little bit further ahead.
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With my teenage bonus daughters there were times when I thought is this really my life?They fought nonstop. It was very scary. But now they love each other. So for me, my daughters both went on a debate camp. I can't recommend this thing enough. I can put the link in the podcast. It's in the UK, half the kids, they're on bursaries, so you can get funding for this. And they just learn the debate skills that are used in competitions and the skills are extraordinary, but I didn't expect them both to enjoy this camp, but they both did. I did get a text from one of them saying I did really badly in that debate and I said don't worry, darling, we learn more from the things we do badly than the things we do well. Just think, Hey, I get to learn more.
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And then she sent me another message. But it went really badly. And this is a daughter who I've tended in the past to be quite sort of empathetic with, but I just thought, I've got to teach her how to manage when things don't go well, because the truth is, they often don't. So I just said to her, honestly, you're always going to have bad debates. Sometimes we freeze, sometimes we're not prepared enough. Sometimes the person opposite us is just genuinely brilliant. And we need to learn from them. Don't beat yourself up, have a good cry, move on. Being able to accept that we're going to be genuinely terrible sometimes, and not to catastrophize. It is just part of being good at life.
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Amazing advice.
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And she said to me later that it made such a massive difference that she went into the next debate, and she did brilliantly.
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That's amazing.
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being allowed to be rubbish is amazing.
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Yes. And I think that I have got that wrong in the past where when they've done badly, I've gone Oh, I'm so sorry. What you're sort of implicitly saying is, well, what it's I kind of expected you to do. Oh, that's not good enough.
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Yes. Oh, yes. And you can get better. I'll just add a postscript. I said, just so you know, I'm very impressed with you for going on this course. It really is hard putting yourself out there. I'd far rather see you try and fail spectacularly than never to try because you're scared of doing badly, and you're perfect. I've learned that from doing this podcast, I wouldn't have said that before.
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And it's definitely the way to Right, on to the main subject.
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School holidays are a great go.
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opportunity to pause and reset.
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It's actually really healthy to get young people to take a break and get some sleep. so maybe we should be lowering the bar, especially for the first week; not expecting too much from anybody. I've done this before.
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It's the first week, and they crawl out of bed really late.
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They've just trashed the kitchen. Nobody seems to care.
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And it's frustrating because your life, because you're normally the person who's around the home more depending on whether you're working or not.
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It's just disrupted our schedules, and when our own schedules are disrupted, it's stressful.
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Yeah. And it can be super stressful for parents, you know, if they're working, and they don't have very much time off, you know, especially when they're a bit younger, the kids.
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How are we going to get this to work? How we're going to make this manage this? And if you are on the other end, if you've got lots of activities planned, because maybe you haven't had so much to do yourself and great, now they're on holiday, we're going to do this, this and this, and they're just utterly shattered?
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Or they just think, No way. I don't want to do that.
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Yeah, absolutely.
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They just want to veg for a few days.
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So we've had lots of fantastic responses from listeners of tips, and also the things that they struggle with.
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One of the big things that I saw when I was doing research for this was how important it is to have empathy for your kids.
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Socialization with peers is really important during adolescence. And studies show that the interactions drive the development of their brain. And then they're away from their friends, and if their structure has changed, and they're not spending that time together, with their friends and they're spending lots of time with their family who annoy them or who they think are lame, or they're just being watched. It can be really tough. So we need to think, how's it going to be feeling for them? Because ptherwise we might think, God, you're just lounging around being lazy.
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And being lazy is - you know - school is a long, old day. I think by the time they get to the summer holidays, they're genuinely really tired.
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And we have this funny culture that says, We should always be doing stuff. And we really struggle with seeing our kids just being human and doing nothing. We think then they're really being really lazy. But maybe they're just actually doing what all other animals do, which is restorative; not very much. But we struggle with it.
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And we feel it now that they if they're being lazy, they have to go and do something or do chores or get jobs done, which is also really good. It's getting a balance.
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Yes, And I think it's checking in with the kids. How are they feeling about things now? I did have some messages from parents who when they'd got older kids they come out of school and the structure falls away, it can be very stressful. So we can say it's really good to have that time to just kind of relax. But we also need to tune into how not having any structure can feel really a bit hard, and difficult to cope with. Because now they've got to suddenly think, well, what am I going to do with my time and they end up on their devices?
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Because they don't know what else to do.
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And that's an easy fix. Yes, yeah. But it's great to teach them not to do anything. I guess both I think, I think it's a really important life skill that a lot of us aren't very good at, which is doing nothing and recharging. We try and fill our days and try and you know, sitting doing nothing we find really challenging. And if we can teach our kids to do that without just going to their phones, that's a really great life skill proper properly recharging.
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I'm really bad at that. If I go to the beach within five minutes I'm starting to say I just can't sit here. I get up in the morning because I know now that the best way to reset your clock is to go outside. I take my secateurs out with my coffee and I'm out in the garden clipping but I'm already doing things.
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Yeah. And that's fine. And we're all different.
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We have different you know, personalities and different energy levels. But I think if we're doing something because we hate the feeling of not doing something then that maybe it's something we can help our kids with. One of my kids can go a really, really long time doing nothing. And if I try and get her to do something, because she's not ready, she's just too tired. And it's a disaster. She used to get really tired in school. So now she will recharge and then she'll suddenly go right now I'm done. I will now want to go and do something
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Brilliant and tuning into that and knowing that kid and being able to reflect back to her and say, Okay, I've noticed this about you and then that's part of her life skills. Attica, Bristol says don't let them sleep all day and start to become nocturnal. They play video games and spend too much time online, which is really destructive. Get them outside as much as possible. Even though you may need to bribe them with breakfast in a cafe or a walk to the shops to buy them something.
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Try and spend time together. I know it's a bit of a challenge.
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Claudia said she bribed hers with chai latte and other food - she's Mexican. Yes. So it's this kind of getting them out. Yeah.
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And I remember talking to a man who had seven kids, many of which were now older teenagers.
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And he said, we go on holiday together. And I have one rule.
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Everyone has to be at breakfast.
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I don't care what you do with the rest of your day. You have to be at breakfast. I was on holiday with my bonus daughters.
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And I can tell you it was one of the most stressful, unpleasant things. Because my husband was expecting them to get up and come out. He kept saying, Well, should we include them in this?
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And I said they don't want to come. They want to sleep in until one because they've been out at a club until whatever time, which is what you said they could do. And we're now not a family. This is not a family holiday. This is them hanging out in a really lovely location doing what they want. And you have to decide as a parent, what matters.
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And that's the key, isn't it? It's setting the expectation. Exactly. You're resisting what's happening, then that's no fun for anybody that does that. Usually, if you want it to be a particular way, then that needs to be agreed in advance.
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He was wandering around going, shall we get them up? I just siad, let's go out, go and have some fun, and then come back. And we'll see them when they get up. Yeah.
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But you have to kind of decide
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I took my son and my partner's son and my partner was there as well. They just finished their A levels. And we went away for the weekend. They were knackered. They just finished their exams. So they'd been doing some partying as well. And the tiredness of the exams. And they were knackered.
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And so I said, right, well, we're going to go and do this.
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And this, we're going to go and see the stuff and you're really welcome to join us. Like we'd love you to be there. But if you want to just chill, do whatever you want. We're going to meet here for dinner, and I dropped a pin. And it was brilliant. So then everyone came with good energy.
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And that's the thing, giving yourself space.
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Everybody needs a means of having some downtime. So even if you're all on holiday together, working out how you can. One friend of mine dealt with it where she said, every day, there would be an hour and she said this is my reading time. Don't interrupt me, I'm reading. All right? So you can just call out time during the day and it then gives everyone else permission to go off and do something that they really want to do or just not talk to people that they find irritating whatever it is, and you give off a better vibe when you've got your own area.
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And don't compare yourself with other families. Everybody does things differently. Don't sit there and think, Oh, my goodness, they've got this perfectly wonderful family who are all going out and doing all these amazing things. Just get off social media. If you're feeling stressed about it. Don't look.
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And you don't know what their kids are thinking.
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Yeah, exactly. They might be passively aggressively going
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So, let's go back to electronics. Why do we along.
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care? Let's be honest, it's not all bad. We've had an interview with Natasha, Devon, where she's talked about how you can be really positive on social media.
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My daughters use Snapchat in a really positive way. And my daughter said to me this holiday I realise I'm on my phone a huge amount but I'm trying to give myself a break because normally I'm not. And I'm trying to stay in contact with my friends.
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That's fine. We know they need to in contact. So that's okay.
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As we've talked about it before, The phone is never the problem; it's getting stuck.
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Yeah, What do they want to do? How do they want to
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Yes, it's getting stuck what you're using it for? and it's associated with poor sleep. And if they're spend their time or have their friends around? Because that using it in the wrong way, it can lower self esteem, poor body really makes a big difference.
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My kids spend half the holiday image. Just remember if they're at home and all their mates are at their dads, which - you know- they've been doing that for in Mykonos, you know, or on Snapchat, they can see on the maps that all their mates are doing something really fun, - years. And it does mean that the time we have when they come back for example - they're all at the Taylor Swift concert, that's is much shorter. So we you know, we go away with our family and going to be very painful. So just be aware that is not something you want your kids spending their time in the holiday doing. Sit down with each child, get their feedback on the option. Say, let's talk about it your use, and give them some control over how this unfolds.
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it also means that they have different ways of being with their dad. So you know, how they use their electronics, I have no influence over that. So - like we talked about all the times picking your battles. What's important to you in this holiday. Sleep, I tend to let mine sleep. However they want to in the holidays, but we only have like half of it. When we're on holiday, you know, they kind of want to get up and do stuff, but not all the time. It's just a fluid negotiation. Yeah. And some days I want to do stuff or have work to do or going away or doing something. And some days not. So it's like, Oh, come on, guys, do you want to do this?
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I'd call it a fluid negotiation.
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I think that's absolutely brilliant. Because we have to start understanding that they will have their own desires, opinions on things, and there's no harm in saying, so here's how I see it. One of my daughters will always get up early. She's a much earlier riser, and the other one would sleep in. And I said to the sleeper we're on that track now of going back to school. So my suggestion is that we start getting up at nine, what do you think? I didn't say I'm going to do it. She said, Yeah, actually, that's a good idea. The first day I got her up, I went up there, opened her curtains. The next day, she woke up herself.
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She's exhausted. Yeah. But it's part of the resetting so that they don't go back to school and struggle because they have been sleeping nocturnally the whole holidays, it's going to be easier. So I use this sort of last couple of weeks to just transition them slowly to give them more of a sense of okay I'll go to bed earlier, I'll feel better. And just slowly adjusting.
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I've always massively failed at doing that.
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But you're successful at all the other things so I wouldn't worry about it.
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I try and do that and massively fail and then they just have to have the shock readjustment.
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It's about how does it work for you, and it's about negotiation. My kids like it because it means that she's now she actually said to me, I don't really like waking up at midday because I feel like my day is gone. So she's she can do something she wants as well. And that's what it needs to be.
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Yeah. My 15 year old absolutely loves being up at night, and he's very sociable as well. He prioritizes being up late, and that's his choice. So then he feels bit rubbish at the beginning of term.
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Keeping them busy is an interesting one because we've had quite a few parents giving us ways in which they do this now Claire gives them extra jobs to do in the house for a wage. She doesn't stress too much about them sleeping in. She said they'll get back into a routine when they get back to school. Sophie sons work for five pounds an hour making kindling, log splitting mowing lawns, helping process falling trees picking falling apples, they love it, which is you know, they're enjoying being outside. It's super healthy. It's physical.
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It's different from school.
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Natalie loves using projects to keep them busy. So she got her son's to plan an irrigation system and fit it for a small garden project. Wow. She's a designer. Yeah, and you know what, how wonderful for those boys. Because actually what they've done is something very problem solving in the real world. And that must feel amazing. Lulu says her son got a job this summer. Yeah, brilliant. And she said it's been wonderful seeing him motivated, full of purpose, enjoying the money he's earning and his sense of satisfaction.
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He's a much easier person to be around. And the mom guilt of, you know, him being in bed and on screens is gone. How wonderful.
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I found this difficult, not so much now as they're older. And they're pretty independent because of their age and what they do. But, you know, when they were younger, and being on my own with them, it's really, really tiring. Yes. Like, and to be on it and, you know, making activities. What can I give them that is more appealing than being on screens because something has to be really exciting for them to not want to be on and feeling responsible for all of that, all the flippin meals and snacks. And, all of that is really tiring. So we have to be really kind to ourselves, and allow ourselves to recharge and allow ourselves to have days where do you know what, we're just going to have cornflakes for dinner. And that's fine. It's just
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Or Marmite and butter on pasta,
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Exactly. But it's really tiring and maybe not really recognizing it at the time. And thinking that, Oh, I wasn't doing a proper job of giving them a good summer
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It's tiring, yes. And that's why it's so holiday.
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important not to compare yourself to other people, because other people don't have the same situation you have.
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What used to stress me before was that I used to hate the weekends, because then my workload would go up dramatically, because there would be me having to manage all the mess and the stress of having to cook all the time. And then the holidays are just an extension of that. But I've discovered that actually setting them the task of coming up with- what are your goals? Think big. What would you like to achieve? What kind of things would you like to be able to do by the end of this holiday? And they can come up with some really creative ideas rather than me having to do it all. And then me sitting there and saying, so how do you think you can get that done? So you don't even have to be the person who sets the irrigation project. You can say what would you like to know? What would you like to be good at? Well, here's how you do it. And coach them instead.
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if they have the time for it, and they and they also, it's very age related?
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Because when they're young teens, I think that's really, really cool and exciting for them. I think most of them when they get a bit older, though.
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They're off kind of doing their own thing. And then you're like, Oh, yeah. Which is great. I mean,
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I think it's great. They're off doing their own thing. Yes. And that's a sign that you've done a successful job with them in a way.
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That's what I tell myself. Yeah,
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II do think coming back to the house actually getting them involved is important. They're living in the house. Getting them involved in being part of what running a house is about - like going shopping, go water the tomatoes, come to the shops with me, get that rhythm going. And they're learning new skills all the time by doing that. And they're involved with you and you're doing things together.
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Yeah, it's really nice. So my oldest is, is I would say this to his face. So it's fine. It is unbelievably lazy. And has a twinkle in his eye so tries to get away with anything. So he would reluctantly help with stuff like that, but when he does, it's fine. And he'll happily come shopping with me and stuff like that. Whereas the others are maybe a bit more like oh, can I cook dinner? Can I do that? So it's you know, it's not making it too heavy.
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And drop your standards. Don't expect they're going to cook like you're in a restaurant. Allow them to experiment and don' think, oh goodness, what am I going to be eating tonight? It's fine. It's okay, that the kitchen looks a bit of a mess. Slowly coax them.
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I have slowly transitioned them into now where, everybody gets up after supper. Everybody clears away the plates. So it's a team job, and then my daughter makes hot chocolate.
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Oh, there's a great one that FP massage came up with, make your home the place to be yes.
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Teenagers need the company of other teenagers Well, why not make a virtue out of it, you don't have to have a swimming pool, just a dartboard on an old wall. And you need a full fridge probably
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Yeah, and the vibe I think is most important they need space to be. But not everybody has space. So even if you haven't got space, just kind of a space where they can just be themselves and you're not in the room. Yeah, that's, that's cool.
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She sent us a photo. She had four 25 year olds and two 18 year olds on the couch watching football together. So they don't even have to be doing anything particularly virtuous, just hanging out together. This is really, really beneficial for them,
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they often hang out at ours, like, we have a table tennis table, which takes up space in the garden. And they've spent ages playing on that. And then they'll go and get sweets, and then they'll come back again. Like it's not like big event.
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It's all part of the whole learning. And exercise is really, really beneficial. So that's the one thing that I mention to my daughter's on a daily basis, right? What exercise is happening today, I'm not telling you how to do anything specific.
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What are you going to do? Are you going to walk the dogs? Are you're going to go around the garden dead-heading? I don't care, but you have to do some exercise, that's a non negotiable. Because it's really beneficial to them to be outside in the sunlight, just 15 minutes even. So I'm not prepared to leave them in their rooms the whole day and not be able to come out. You can do a sort of family tech free time where you say, Do you know what Let's all have this particular time in the day where we have a meal together. No one's allowed their tech or we all watch a film together. So you know that everybody has bought into it.
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Yeah. And then what do you want to see? Or let's all go to the cinema together? But also, I think really importantly, kind of respect if they go no, I don't want to go.
00:27:04.710 --> 00:27:06.809
Yeah, exactly.
00:27:04.710 --> 00:27:06.809
I think that's totally fair.
00:27:06.809 --> 00:27:08.220
It's painful
00:27:08.000 --> 00:27:28.549
In my head we're doing this tonight and we read way too much into it when they just don't want to; they're not in the mood. .Well, maybe they made other plans so we can just go Oh, okay. And that's fine.
00:27:25.369 --> 00:27:32.150
But when can we? What about Wednesday? What about Thursday?
00:27:28.549 --> 00:27:34.519
And then find a time that works for everybody. And we respect when they say no, and
00:27:34.359 --> 00:27:57.339
those family traditions, There are times where we have marks in our calendar, where we say we as a family, do this. Keep some of those, but I'd be prepared to discuss it with your teen. And then they might say I really find it strange or all those members of family or I don't like all the driving, Have those conversations and don't take it to heart if they say actually, can I bail this one out?
00:27:58.269 --> 00:28:03.220
That it might not be working for them. It's really Yes. And then they learn to say no when something isn't working for them.
00:28:03.369 --> 00:28:26.740
finally, I would say evaluate and learn from each holiday. Now, it might sound a bit over the top, but we do this. Whenever I host a party or anything. I always sit everyone down and go, Hey, guys, let's grab a snack or something, and then I'll just say what was good? And what was bad. What can we do better? How did that go?
00:28:22.089 --> 00:28:43.240
Because everybody loves having an opinion. Yeah, this was great. This is awful. And I don't take it personally, I just wear it as a means of thinking what can we learn from this experience. So when it comes to the end of the holiday, which most of you will be at this particular time when this is going out - Just sit with the kids and ask what worked?
00:28:43.450 --> 00:28:49.059
I love that we do that. Like if we go away or do some we do like a five favorite things, which is
00:28:49.000 --> 00:28:50.589
really fun. I like that. Yes.
00:28:52.809 --> 00:28:55.089
I quite like those sort of evaluation parts of it.
00:28:55.089 --> 00:29:01.390
You know, the things that didn't work and also over a general holiday, not just because you've been away somewhere. Yeah, that's nice. I'm gonna borrow that.
00:29:01.779 --> 00:29:12.549
Like my daughter. She's read Daniel Kahneman Thinking Fast and Slow book. And in it, he talks about the way that we remember things.
00:29:08.650 --> 00:29:33.519
I've read the book too. And what was hilarious was - because normally we go away for two weeks to this place in France and we just hike, mostly hike - she said, two weeks is no no better than one week because your brain doesn't remember it that way. According to Daniel Kahneman. So really, I think we need two different holidays. The two weeks is not really doing it for me.
00:29:34.680 --> 00:30:00.509
I love that and I thought well she's coming up with facts. And the great thing is that she's got to the age now where her friends are inviting her to stay with their family, and we're inviting her friends to come and stay with us in exchange, and it means that both kids get a nice different holiday and it's perfect, less stress all around.
00:29:56.849 --> 00:30:04.950
It's all about the friends. So make sure you make friends with your kids' friends parents.
00:30:05.190 --> 00:30:10.289
Yeah. My daughter is away this week. She went this morning at the crack of dawn.
00:30:07.799 --> 00:30:10.289
She's having a great time.
00:30:10.410 --> 00:30:14.970
Amazing. And then we have a little bit more space to just be with the other kids
00:30:14.000 --> 00:30:16.849
who go wait! She's there. That's not fair.
00:30:16.849 --> 00:30:25.880
Ha! Oh, well, anyway, do you find holiday stressful or a magical time?
00:30:21.289 --> 00:30:25.880
Honestly, I am starting to go.
00:30:26.059 --> 00:30:36.980
Wait, she's Wait, what age? You mean I only have two more summers? Is it even it is two more summers before she's properly gone. Yeah. And I know they come back. But they don't.
00:30:39.650 --> 00:30:40.730
I'm on my last one.
00:30:44.779 --> 00:30:52.910
That's the thing. It does happen quite quickly once your kids are at the stage. So just cherish it.
00:30:53.119 --> 00:31:19.369
It's a really important point, actually, because it's kind of a bit mind blowing to think, Oh, you only have this amount of summers left? I do genuinely believe because I have one who's 18. and fingers crossed, depending on some results that will be coming in a couple of days. I don't know what he'll be doing next year, but he it be different. It will be very different. But I do think if you say do you want to come on holiday with us? Then they go okay, that will be great. Thanks very much.
00:31:19.430 --> 00:31:21.140
Yeah. Oh, yeah, what you're paying?
00:31:21.470 --> 00:31:27.529
Exactly that! But it's very different. Yeah.
00:31:24.680 --> 00:31:29.059
So you don't have those really long summers where you know, they'll be home.
00:31:29.210 --> 00:32:02.329
Yeah. So if you found this useful, please share it. Hit the Follow button to make sure you don't miss anything. You can contact us at teenagers untangled@gmail.com on Instagram, Facebook. I'm not very good on Facebook if I'm honest. So just, you know, Instagram if you can, or our own website, which is www.teenagersuntangled.com. You can even leave a voicemail on our websites. Suzy has her own excellent Instagram account and website where you can get amazing tips to calm yourself in this most stressful times. And you can book her
00:32:02.368 --> 00:32:22.200
Yes, I have a on my website, which is www.amindful-life.co.uk You can book a free 15 minute chat so I can help you with a particular problem or guide you to what you might need or give you some tips as a parent, how to calm your nervous system, all that kind of stuff. So you're very welcome to do that.
00:32:22.348 --> 00:32:25.949
Great. Thanks for listening. And until next time, goodbye. Bye bye for now.
